Dungeons

SinisterSoft

I'm making a new game that's similar in principle to Dandy (the game that the classic arcade game Gauntlet was based on).

It's called 'Dungeons', it's for up to 8 players (if the system supports it).

I've got the general idea of how it's all going to work in my head, but I'm open to fresh ideas on what to add.

Here is the current work in progress:



If you have any ideas or suggestions then please let me know.

jdbc

Gauntlet gameplay is quite cool, keep going this way.

techdojo

@SinisterSoft - how are you handling the multiplayer, is it locally via an adhoc connection?

Also unless you're supporting a controller, ditch the onscreen joypad - IMHO they never work well, maybe try a touch to move to a point and then maybe have a button to fire (or double tap to toggle auto fire), if you have a small circular zone around your player you'll be able to rotate on the spot to face the desired firing direction.

Other than that - try and stick as close to the original as possible - especially for multiplayer.

#IfItAintBroke...

jdbc

I guess colaborative between players is the key to complete the missions.

Collect coins to buy powerups(indestructible for a while, special weapon) and to improve player experience in a similar way to RPG.

SinisterSoft

@techdojo the on screen joypad only appears if you touch the screen. If player one controls the joypad then it will also disappear.

Multiplayer is currently all on screen at once with it scaling out.

I might do some kind of local networking for alternate play - but not sure yet.

@jdbc I was thinking of keeping more like the what people are used to, I'll see what people think once the enemy sprites are active.

SinisterSoft

Here is a new video:

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10206114197115103

totebo

That's awesome. Especially how fast it is. What path detection do you use, and do you optimize it in some clever way? In Miner Z I got a slowdown with more than 10 zombies chasing the player on an iPod Touch using A*, and calculating only when the zombie reaches its destination.

SinisterSoft

Thanks.

I've tested it will a full screen of ghosts and zombies with no slow down - on a HTC M8 and an oDroid c1. They move in the general direction of the player and detect blocks as they encounter them - if there is a 3x1 way around it then they will move around the block (I don't know if this makes any sense. )

SinisterSoft

Here is another pic of a stress test....

jdbc

Have you used Tilemap and box2d for collision?

pie

@SinisterSoft your pathfinder seems to be very smart, can you please tell more about it?
Does every ghost instance check for his next tile on enterframe? How do you choose which is the "next alternative tile" if the first one is blocked?
Thank you,
and keep it up, it looks great!

SinisterSoft

@jdbc I don't use box2d as it's the kiss of death as far as speed is concerned. The game has to run at 60hz... Box2d has it's place though and I'd use it for something like Angry Birds - but not for a platformer or this type of game.

@pie Thanks. You can't see it from the video - but it isn't a single player game - up to 8 people can play and it scales out to show everyone/every enemy in the map. No slowdown at 60hz. I'm using LuaJIT, but I don't know how much that is making a difference - I suspect a lot...

How the sprites know where to go:|

Everything (EVERYTHING!) can collide with everything else. it does a dx*dx + dy*dy check on every sprite with every player (up to 8 on screen at once) to find the nearest player to itself. It then check to see if it can collide with the something in the nearest space, if not then if it's a diagonal then it also checks the position on either side of the diagonal. If all is ok then it moves towards that position. If not then it then checks the block to the next rotation (either left or right), does the same diagonal check, and if all ok moves there. If it is blocked then it stops doing anything for 30 frames - then it tries again. It does this for map blocks and for all other sprites.

Every sprite also check for the player moving on every turn too, it the re-adjusts to see if there is a nearer player or if it needs to change direction.

One thing I did to speed things up is never add or remove children to the parent sprite - I just hide them, mark them as hidden in a table, then re-use them as needed. Adding and removing children would kill the game.

The sprite class also isn't modified - only the frame event gets the events. I suspect the enhancing the sprite class would slow things down (but simplify the programming). Events are a killer - get rid of them.

All sprites are also draw order sorted by their Y position. I do one pass per frame and hope no-one spots an overlap.

SinisterSoft

Re LuaJIT bytecode, if you aren't using it already then you should be. Here is a patch for the Windows version of Gideros - includes the Android LuaJIT libs:

http://giderosmobile.com/forum/discussion/5646/luajit-patch

pie

@SinisterSoft I suppose that there are certain prerequisites to have noticeable improvements with luaJit, I don't understand which ones...

I tried again luajit in a "big game" I am writing, but there is no improvement (overall response is slower than without it).
I suppose that I am doing something that kills any possible benefit, but I can't figure out what

Could it be because I have a lot of lua files in my project? This should not be an issue if luajit compiles all files on app start, but from the performance of my game I'd say it's compling them as soon as it needs any, and then recompile it when the file is needed again..
do you know how is it working?
Thank you

[edit. sorry I should have posted this in http://giderosmobile.com/forum/discussion/5646/luajit-patch ]

SinisterSoft

I think you can turn the jit off - I think there is a table called jit that you can use. That way it will work in interpreter mode - which again is faster than standard lua.

I have one main lua file - so I don't know if that's got anything to do with it. I group a lot of things together - processing things in batches. I don't use a lot of functions in the main game loop. I use a lot of local variables and make a few library functions local to the program. I have no idea if any of this makes a difference or not.

You should do some tests with an empty project and add things - see if there is something that is somehow killing the performance for luaJIT over normal Lua.

http://luajit.org/performance_arm.html

The kids added some sound effects - so made another video...

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10206135442166216

SinisterSoft

I just added alpha to the sprites as they scale out of generators. I can't tell if it makes a difference.

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10206136357229092

SinisterSoft

Here is a screenshot of two players at different parts of the map (the game scales out) - still runs fine at 60hz...

The dx*dx+dy*dy routine seems to work fine at the enemy sprites are evenly divided diagonally towards each player.

SinisterSoft

Stress test on a mobile:

antix

@SinisterSoft - Used internet exploder and checked out the video, nice

SinisterSoft

I might add a blood 'splatter' layer next, thinking about the best way to do it...

SinisterSoft

Blood splatter - in or out?

antix

@SinisterSoft - while it looks interesting.. go ghosts and skeletons even need to bleed?? Maybe dust clouds for them

talis

In my opinion Blood splatting effect is good but no need to overuse it in every hit.
It can trigger in some special conditions like:
-When the hit point of hero is so low and takes one more hit.
-When a critical hit occurs. (I don't know in your game do you have this aspect but just an idea)
-When some special skills are used. ( I also don't know if you have special skills in your game or not )

For example i always liked the way in Wolfenstein whenever you are low in HP your portrait becomes bloody, and the screen is also getting red and red and red ...:D

I totally agree on @antix about ghosts and skeletons. For example ghosts can splat ectoplasm which is green, skeletons can splat dust, and humanoids can splat red blood.

Last bonus opinion for blood effect:
If you will use blood splatter effect so less you can make one more effect like stepping on blood.
Whenever your character will step on splatted blood and move to the next tile without any blood on the tile, small steps of blood can appear. This effect later can be perished with a timer.

SinisterSoft

I was thinking of making it so ghosts leave nothing behind, skeletons maybe leave bits of bone behind and overything else and players leave blood behind.

What do you think?

SinisterSoft

@talis I like the faded blood steps idea.

totebo

Regards blood splatter: I'd avoid it to keep it kid friendly, and not cut a large chunk of potential players out. Green blood may be more accepted. Also, leaving the blood splatters in there looks a bit too structured to me, it reveals the grid.

SinisterSoft

I understand what you mean about the kid friendly, I'll have to see how likely it is that people have set restrictions.

It looks better and less grid-like now I've added more types.

antix

@SinisterSoft - Yes, more variety will make it look way less griddy. If the monsters who bleed are fantasy monsters then the blood splatters could be maybe a reddish purple.

I still can't for the life of me fathom how some people think if you have green blood splatter it's okay, as long as it's not red. I mean you are killing things in the game and the aim of the game is to kill things for points, so whats the problem?

SinisterSoft

Zombies could have a dark green splatter, ghosts and skeletons none - but everything else deep dark red splatter...

totebo

I agree, the colour of the blood shouldn't make any difference. But in some countries, USA in particular, even a drop of blood can mean an 18+ label, which is something you don't want. Especially with this so far extremely promising and impressive game, sinister!

SinisterSoft

18+ on mobile means nothing though as the point of sale is the phone - so unless they have set restrictions - does it matter?